Monday, 23 March 2015

WHY DO THEY KEEP TALKING ABOUT A COALITION THAT HAS BEEN RULED OUT?

Why do the Tories keep on about how unthinkably bad a coalition between Labour and the SNP would be for the UK?


As far as I understand, Nicola Sturgeon has ruled out any such coalition. Alex Salmond said the same thing yesterday on the Marr show. And Ed Miliband appears to have officially ruled it out too.



In the event of a hung parliament the SNP has said that it will not do a deal that will put the Tories into Number 10. 


It has not said that it wouldn't do a similar deal to put Labour in... and, let's be honest, one of them has to be there. Clegg, or his successor as Liberal leader, is not going to be the Prime Minister.


The reality, as I understand it, is that every government has to be able to get a budget through parliament.  That means getting it through the Commons as the aristocrats are not allowed to overturn a budget. That is the essential in whether or not a government will work.



An arrangement whereby Angus Robertson's team would negotiate and agree on a budget, is surely something that would allow Miliband to go to the Queen and say that he could command a majority in the Commons.



After that, without a coalition, any party can vote on those things with which it agrees, and vote against those things with which is does not. The SNP would vote on law which broadly met its social democratic principles and against law which did not.



Surely that is the way it should work in any case, unless you apply the Bain Principle, whereby you refuse to  back an individual policy on the basis that it has been initiated by a party you hate.

There is no rule that says you have to back a particular party all the way. Even within the present Tory/Liberal coalition there are issues where the parties have not backed each other. (Most notably the Tories refused to back the Liberal changes to the House of Lords, which would have seen some element of election, and the Liberals refused to back Tory changes to the House of Commons, which would have given them an advantage over Labour.)

Mr Miliband has not yet even been asked if he would accept this kind of arrangement. Perhaps it would be an idea for someone to ask him?


The SNP has said that it would vote on English-only matters where there was a consequence of these policies for the funding arrangements in Scotland. Surely that is only fair. If an England only policy is going to result in a alteration to the funding in Scotland, then that affects the Scottish population and Scottish MPs deserve a voice.



Equally it seems reasonable that matters which have no consequence in Scotland, should be left to English or English and Welsh MPs to vote on, as appropriate.

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20 comments:

  1. Well it seems we are not popular in England, cannot think why, they were all calling on us to stay but now we are, we are a threat to the stability of the UK apparently, well that is what they said on the telly today.
    Ed Miliband is another :Labour failure, they keep electing the wrong ones, he has been dragged into declaring this because of the Tory Newspapers down south. If he was at all clever he would simply have said that he would decide about what he will do should it be necessary, but he gave a hostage to fortune and he is trying to appease South East England man who he needs to vote for him. AS far as I can see the Pundits at Westminster are terrified of us Midgies.

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  2. I doubt in all honesty we are a threat to the stability of the UK. We are a small part of it, with less than 10% of the population. Apparently, we are a drag on the economy, needing constant subsidy from them. How could we possibly, if we left, make much of a difference to their stability.

    They would be rich without all the subsidies they have to keep paying for us.

    Milibland is just not a leader. I'm sure he's a nice bloke, but he's not a political leader.

    Nor really, of course, is Cameron. Way too stupid.

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  3. You HAVE to read Mark Frankland's tale (linked in the sidebar).

    We really need to change our society.

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    1. Do not know what happened Tris I replied to you about reading Mark Frankland's post and saying this was terrible. I hate what this country has become that people have to suffer like this. I watched a wee boy walking past us this morning and wondered if we can get Scotland into a good place where he will never suffer these indignities.

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  4. Sorry Tryi but thought I'd put up these links for anyone who has not yet seen them. ;-)

    Alex Salmond on Andrew Marr show with Anna Soubry. If there was EVER an advert for "go away you nasty man don't touch me" THIS must be in the running. LOL

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVkGHdwGnEw

    The latest Tory Party Po;litical Broadcast. What a pity they have no idea where the termini are for ALL trains arriving from Scotland are. The last time I checked these termini were located NORTH of the Thames but hey what do I know I'm just aScot who is too wee, too poor and too stupid to know any different.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JeYlBRvUeE&t=35

    Finally the latest wee video from oor Jim, him of the Twitter name @JimMurphyMP or @JimforScotland or is it @JimforJim I can never quite rermember these days. I think though what HE actually says is brilliant. Never a truer word was spoken by a politician as the words he speaks in this video.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpCLPoivTSA&feature=youtu.be

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    1. Yet she is reported to have said she found him charming? Strange woman.

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    2. Thanks Arbroath. Jim's new video is a comedy...

      Aye David. She's a weird woman, but she's a Tory, so anything is possible.

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  5. BBC thinks SNP a Threat Ch4 going around telling people how to vote, welcome to N.Korea people democracy UK is dead in the water.

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    1. Next thing we'll have Nicola Sturgeons words read by an actor!

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    2. Funnily I am waiting on that.

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  6. Its been a slow learning for many that the UK isn't a democracy. Princeton University in the USA has just carried out a study that reports that the US isn't a democracy either. S'funny, there seems to be some indication that the UK and US Governments (regardless of the party on the masthead) are simply there to keep the populace under control and generate massive profits for banks and multi-national corporations. Who would have believed it?

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    1. That seems reasonable. I'd have said that the UK is one of the least democratic countries in the western world...royalty, aristocrats, churchmen, people buying seats in government, privy council, FPTP, whipping and all the delaying techniques they use to make sure that the ordinary MP never gets a word in.

      The mother of parliaments?

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    2. The mother something of all parliaments... ;)

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  7. Tris

    I suspect that this is about Labour and keeping them out of power. Let's not forget the referendum, the Tories have an idea of how the seats are going to work out. They will have a suspicion that a Liberal/DUP coalition might be enough with any UKip back up of the right wing nut jobs that keeps them in power. Plus, it keeps the SNP at bay while hurting Labour, best of all world's for Tory scumbags.

    Miliband is too weak and doesn't want to be seen speaking to the smelly jocks, that won't look good to the upper classes and the nutters if he is talking to Scots. Democracy only matters in London and the South East, the rest of us are slaves.

    I hope the SNP get lots of seats and use any power wisely, if that doesn't work then it might just have to be a declaration of independence no matter how unlikely or far fetched that might seem.

    Interesting times.

    Bruce

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    1. I heard the DUP being mentioned for the first time today, Bruce.

      They seem to be happy to work with either Tories or Labour for a price of a billion extra for Northern Ireland. Of course there are only 8 of them at the moment.

      It's interesting that a party of the right, Euro-sceptic, socially conservative and based on strict protestantism would be happy to work with Labour.

      But then, when you think about it...

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  8. Sorry for going WAY off topic here Tris but thought you might be interested in these links.

    https://m.facebook.com/notes/10152740278692513/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-ts=1421914688&x-yt-cl=84503534&v=YcxGGnmRQAs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7tjnuG-l6g

    To be fair I posted the first on Wings last night and seem to have caused a wee bit of a stir. ... OOPS! LOL

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    1. That's an interesting post.

      I just wonder how on earth anyone could have managed to fiddle these votes on the kind of scale that would be required to "fix" the referendum.

      I wouldn't deny, of course, for a second, that that is what they would like to do, and that the establishment has used everything they possibly could to get the result they wanted.

      The use of the queen, state broadcaster, friends in the London media, and the civil service...all of which is probably, if not illegal, at least immoral.

      But just how did they managed to get all these postal ballots in...?

      Personally, I think that postal ballot should only be allowed where a person is unable to get to the polling station, though absence, or ill health.

      Anything else should be banned.

      I'll be interested to know what others think about it though. I'll go look at Wings.

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  9. Funnily enough Tris my partner and I are of the similar view. If you are able to get to the polling station either by walking or in a wheel chair then you should vote in person. Only those not "in country", in hospital or house bound should have the postal vote.

    That said, if you take what has been uncovered in the Argyll and Bute count then I think you can see it being multiplied across the whole of Scotland, particularly, if as I think most cynics believe MI5/MI6 were heavily involved.

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    1. Well, we have certainly learned that the secret services are not to be trusted to do the right thing... just the thing that is best of the British establishment (as i point out in the new post).

      I can honestly say I'd not be surprised. I doubt though, that the truth will ever out.

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